Blech! Nattering Nabobs of Negativity! :+)

In article
,
Warren wrote:

Oceania's parent company owns Regent Seven Seas and half of NCL.

They're not such a small player.

Why would one use Oceania and Regent which truly are a premium section
of the industry as opposed to some that are marketed as premium but
really are not, as indicators of the health of the cruise industry?
Oceania and Regent combined have only 4000 berths to fill. There is a
limited supply of berths for that niche even if they build one more
1200 passenger ship. Their customer base is not the average middle
class joe or jill. The mass market lines have single ships in their
fleet with 4000 berths and the mass market lines can't fill their ships
with business executives or plastic surgeons, their customer base is
among middle class workers who are hurting right now.

--
Charles

On Feb 27, 6:54*am, Charles wrote:

Why would one use Oceania and Regent snip as indicators of the health of the cruise industry?

I didn't comment on the health of the industry. I commented on what
you said about Oceania being a small player. I disagree. I reminded
you that Oceania is part of a larger company and noticed that you
completely ignored that the parent company now also owns half of NCL
(which has finally become profitable).

It's like saying that Cunard isn't a major player without
acknowledging that Cunard is managed by Princess and part of the
Carnival empire.

If Oceania wasn't a influential player, RCI wouldn't bother with
Azamara.

Warren

On 2/27/10 7:28 PM, in article
, "Warren"
wrote:

On Feb 27, 6:54*am, Charles wrote:

Why would one use Oceania and Regent snip as indicators of the health of
the cruise industry?

I didn't comment on the health of the industry. I commented on what
you said about Oceania being a small player. I disagree. I reminded
you that Oceania is part of a larger company and noticed that you
completely ignored that the parent company now also owns half of NCL
(which has finally become profitable).



Regent and Oceania are owned by Prestige Cruise Holdings, majority owned by
several investment affiliates of Apollo Management, a limited partnership.
Regent and Oceania have separate headquarters.

NCL is owned 50% by Star Cruises and 50% by NCL Investment I and NCL
Investment II, both investment affiliates of Apollo Management, a limited
partnership. There is no management tie between NCL and Prestige. Apollo
calls itself a supportive shareholder of both.




It's like saying that Cunard isn't a major player without
acknowledging that Cunard is managed by Princess and part of the
Carnival empire.

If Oceania wasn't a influential player, RCI wouldn't bother with
Azamara.

Warren

In article
,
Warren wrote:

I didn't comment on the health of the industry. I commented on what
you said about Oceania being a small player. I disagree. I reminded
you that Oceania is part of a larger company and noticed that you
completely ignored that the parent company now also owns half of NCL
(which has finally become profitable).

I ignored it because it was not relevant. We are talking about Oceania,
not a parent company that is managing the investments of a group of
investors. That they are under some larger umbrella not make them a
major player. Likewise Azamara Club does not become a major player just
because it is owned by Royal Caribbean International. These are small
brands that serve a niche market. That does not mean Oceania is not a
great product. It appears to serve it's niche quite well, it gets great
reviews, so adding a couple of ships hopefully will work out well for
them. But adding those particular berths is not a general indicator of
the health of the cruise industry or it's pricing structure.

--
Charles

On Sat, 27 Feb 2010 19:40:34 -0500, Charles
wrote:

But adding those particular berths is not a general indicator of
the health of the cruise industry or it's pricing structure.

Hi Charles,

I agree with you that taken by itself, you should not extrapolate the
health of the cruise industry by Oceania. In this thread and the
other threads on this subject, other cruise lines were mentioned as
raising fares due to the strong bookings we have had so far this year.
Carnival is the largest brand. Carnival is the brand that said
bookings were strong. Carnival is the brand that said they were
raising rates across the board. The Carnival Corporation is the
company that made $1.8 Billion last year. This compares to $2.3
Billion they made the year before. The company has said this year's
bookings are better than last year. Will the strong bookings keep up
when the rates go up. I do not know but those at the cruise lines
must think the net results will be positive or they would not raise
the rates. I guess time will tell.
--
Ray Goldenberg 800-719-9917 or 805-566-3905
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