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#1
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
Hello!
I have 10-12 days to fill in mid-June and a friend and I are hoping to make a road trip to the Copper Canyon region, entering Mexico at Juarez and driving to Creel. I've been lurking here for some time and have found lots of helpful info and advice. However, in putting together a possible itinerary, a whole slew of questions have come to mind that I haven't found clear answers to elsewhere, hence this post. Any answers or feedback to any of the questions below will be very much appreciated. 1) Is it reasonable to drive from Nuevo Casas Grandes to Basaseachic Falls via Highways 10, 28, 23 and 16 (via Madera and La Junta) in one day? How are the road conditions? Estimated time to drive this stretch? 2) At Basaseachic Falls, we probably won't be making the six-hour round trip hike to the base of the falls. But I understand there are some good viewpoints without making the entire hike. True? 3) What are the chances in mid-June of arriving in Creel without room reservations and getting a place to stay? I've found a couple of places on the Net (Best Western, Villa Mexicana) that can be reserved on-line, but they are pricey. I have phone numbers of several other places in Creel that are probably more reasonable. Anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? Or, again, are reservations even advisable for that time of year? 4) We'd like to take the train into the canyons perhaps as far as Temoris or Bahuichivo to spend at least one night. Is it possible to just go to the station in Creel before the train leaves and get tickets on the spot? There are outfits in the US that will make reservations and sell tickets but only for first class. We are fine with second class. 5) Once in Temoris or Bahuichivo, what is the ease of getting lodging (clean room, private bath, if possible)? Reservations recommended? Can those arrangements be made once in Creel, or is it better to book something farther in advance? 6) We'd like to take an overnight (at least) bus excursion to Batopilas. From what I've read, it seems easy enough to arrange a trip from any hotel in Creel. True? 7) Should there be any problem finding a place to stay in Batopilas in mid-June? Or are accommodations booked as part of the bus trip or separately? If separately, any recommendations of places to stay? Reservations advised/necessary? Sorry for the long post and all the questions. And many thanks in advance for any answers and advice! Happy travels to all, Bart |
#3
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
"Bad Bart" wrote in message . com... Hello! 2) At Basaseachic Falls, we probably won't be making the six-hour round trip hike to the base of the falls. But I understand there are some good viewpoints without making the entire hike. True? Yes, the view from the top of the falls is quite spectacular. 3) What are the chances in mid-June of arriving in Creel without room reservations and getting a place to stay? I've found a couple of places on the Net (Best Western, Villa Mexicana) that can be reserved on-line, but they are pricey. I have phone numbers of several other places in Creel that are probably more reasonable. Anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? Or, again, are reservations even advisable for that time of year? The Los Pinos is clean and comfortable. I can't remember the name of the place that the hostel near the main square sent us to when they were full, but it was nicer and very reasonable. Most of the time there seems to be plenty of rooms in Creel. 4) We'd like to take the train into the canyons perhaps as far as Temoris or Bahuichivo to spend at least one night. Is it possible to just go to the station in Creel before the train leaves and get tickets on the spot? There are outfits in the US that will make reservations and sell tickets but only for first class. We are fine with second class. Tickets are sold on the train as a matter of course. I enjoyed the second class train. It's clean and comfortable. You get to mix with the locals. Food is limited, so pack a big lunch. 6) We'd like to take an overnight (at least) bus excursion to Batopilas. From what I've read, it seems easy enough to arrange a trip from any hotel in Creel. True? I've only driven there, but it looks very easy to arrange transportation. There's a bus that runs one way one day and the opposite direction the next. According to a sign on the main square the taxis there (old toyota sedans) will take you to Batopilias. There are any number of private or group tours you could take. If you hang around the main square for any length of time you will be repeatedly asked if you'd like a tour. I enjoyed the Casa Monse when I was there. It's very rustic. It's located between the main square and the river, which puts you in the middle of what little is going on there. I found the owners very interesting people to chat with. Dennis |
#4
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
Thanks, Don, for your reply. Your observation about hotel space in Creel and
the canyon is encouraging. I appreciated your mention of the scenery between Temoris and El Fuerte. I am now considering extending the rail portion of the trip to El Fuerte, BTW, I enjoyed your report of your trip in your earlier post!. Many thanks again, Bart "Donald Hazle" wrote in message om... Bart, I can answer a few of your questions. #3 We were there two weeks ago and nothing was filled expect the hotels in El Furte. The hotels in the canyon and Creel appeared to have plenty of room. Our guide said that business was off about 30% for the last 2 years. However he said that the Mexicans normally come to the canyon in the summer. If you are going only to Temoris you will be on the second class train. The first class train does not stop there. Your will also miss some of the best scenery between Temoris and El Furte. I saw several hotel bus tours. But will they run in the heat of summer... I just don't know. Don Hazle "Bad Bart" wrote in message .com... Hello! I have 10-12 days to fill in mid-June and a friend and I are hoping to make a road trip to the Copper Canyon region, entering Mexico at Juarez and driving to Creel. I've been lurking here for some time and have found lots of helpful info and advice. However, in putting together a possible itinerary, a whole slew of questions have come to mind that I haven't found clear answers to elsewhere, hence this post. Any answers or feedback to any of the questions below will be very much appreciated. 1) Is it reasonable to drive from Nuevo Casas Grandes to Basaseachic Falls via Highways 10, 28, 23 and 16 (via Madera and La Junta) in one day? How are the road conditions? Estimated time to drive this stretch? 2) At Basaseachic Falls, we probably won't be making the six-hour round trip hike to the base of the falls. But I understand there are some good viewpoints without making the entire hike. True? 3) What are the chances in mid-June of arriving in Creel without room reservations and getting a place to stay? I've found a couple of places on the Net (Best Western, Villa Mexicana) that can be reserved on-line, but they are pricey. I have phone numbers of several other places in Creel that are probably more reasonable. Anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? Or, again, are reservations even advisable for that time of year? 4) We'd like to take the train into the canyons perhaps as far as Temoris or Bahuichivo to spend at least one night. Is it possible to just go to the station in Creel before the train leaves and get tickets on the spot? There are outfits in the US that will make reservations and sell tickets but only for first class. We are fine with second class. 5) Once in Temoris or Bahuichivo, what is the ease of getting lodging (clean room, private bath, if possible)? Reservations recommended? Can those arrangements be made once in Creel, or is it better to book something farther in advance? 6) We'd like to take an overnight (at least) bus excursion to Batopilas. From what I've read, it seems easy enough to arrange a trip from any hotel in Creel. True? 7) Should there be any problem finding a place to stay in Batopilas in mid-June? Or are accommodations booked as part of the bus trip or separately? If separately, any recommendations of places to stay? Reservations advised/necessary? Sorry for the long post and all the questions. And many thanks in advance for any answers and advice! Happy travels to all, Bart |
#5
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
Dennis,
Thanks a lot for your reply. I've enjoyed reading your posts over all the time I've lurked in this NG. Your experience and answers will go a long way in helping me plan my trip. I especially appreciated your Los Pinos tip and your comments regarding the ease of arranging a trip to Batopilas. I have a couple of further questions about the train: Just to clarify, when you said that tickets are "sold on the train as a matter of course," you meant that second class tickets can be bought right on the spot prior to departure, yes? And is it correct that there are two distinct trains, one first class and the other second? (I had been thinking there was only one train each way each day with both first- and second-class cars.) Also do you know if Creel has an ATM? Again, many thanks for the help you've already given. Bart "Technobarbarian" wrote in message news:laF7c.24354$uh.2381@fed1read02... "Bad Bart" wrote in message . com... Hello! 2) At Basaseachic Falls, we probably won't be making the six-hour round trip hike to the base of the falls. But I understand there are some good viewpoints without making the entire hike. True? Yes, the view from the top of the falls is quite spectacular. 3) What are the chances in mid-June of arriving in Creel without room reservations and getting a place to stay? I've found a couple of places on the Net (Best Western, Villa Mexicana) that can be reserved on-line, but they are pricey. I have phone numbers of several other places in Creel that are probably more reasonable. Anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? Or, again, are reservations even advisable for that time of year? The Los Pinos is clean and comfortable. I can't remember the name of the place that the hostel near the main square sent us to when they were full, but it was nicer and very reasonable. Most of the time there seems to be plenty of rooms in Creel. 4) We'd like to take the train into the canyons perhaps as far as Temoris or Bahuichivo to spend at least one night. Is it possible to just go to the station in Creel before the train leaves and get tickets on the spot? There are outfits in the US that will make reservations and sell tickets but only for first class. We are fine with second class. Tickets are sold on the train as a matter of course. I enjoyed the second class train. It's clean and comfortable. You get to mix with the locals. Food is limited, so pack a big lunch. 6) We'd like to take an overnight (at least) bus excursion to Batopilas. From what I've read, it seems easy enough to arrange a trip from any hotel in Creel. True? I've only driven there, but it looks very easy to arrange transportation. There's a bus that runs one way one day and the opposite direction the next. According to a sign on the main square the taxis there (old toyota sedans) will take you to Batopilias. There are any number of private or group tours you could take. If you hang around the main square for any length of time you will be repeatedly asked if you'd like a tour. I enjoyed the Casa Monse when I was there. It's very rustic. It's located between the main square and the river, which puts you in the middle of what little is going on there. I found the owners very interesting people to chat with. Dennis |
#6
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
"Bad Bart" wrote in message . com... I have a couple of further questions about the train: Just to clarify, when you said that tickets are "sold on the train as a matter of course," you meant that second class tickets can be bought right on the spot prior to departure, yes? In Creel you actually buy tickets from the conducter after you've boarded the train. The conducter comes around with a handheld electronic device that prints out the tickets. Tickets are not sold at the station. They are sold at the station in Los Mochis. And is it correct that there are two distinct trains, one first class and the other second? (I had been thinking there was only one train each way each day with both first- and second-class cars.) There are two distinct trains that travel about an hour apart, with the first class train in the lead. Also do you know if Creel has an ATM? You know, there must be one there somewhere, but I don't remember seeing it, or a bank. Pretty much every bank in Mexico has an ATM, but I don't recall having seen either in Creel. Dennis |
#7
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
Bart, I should mention that the it is the hour and 30 minutes after
Temoris that is real good. After that the the remainder of the trip into El Fuerte is flat but still somewhat interesting. Since you are going in summer it still be light at that time... it was dark for us. Don "Bad Bart" wrote in message .com... Thanks, Don, for your reply. Your observation about hotel space in Creel and the canyon is encouraging. I appreciated your mention of the scenery between Temoris and El Fuerte. I am now considering extending the rail portion of the trip to El Fuerte, BTW, I enjoyed your report of your trip in your earlier post!. Many thanks again, Bart "Donald Hazle" wrote in message om... Bart, I can answer a few of your questions. #3 We were there two weeks ago and nothing was filled expect the hotels in El Furte. The hotels in the canyon and Creel appeared to have plenty of room. Our guide said that business was off about 30% for the last 2 years. However he said that the Mexicans normally come to the canyon in the summer. If you are going only to Temoris you will be on the second class train. The first class train does not stop there. Your will also miss some of the best scenery between Temoris and El Furte. I saw several hotel bus tours. But will they run in the heat of summer... I just don't know. Don Hazle "Bad Bart" wrote in message .com... Hello! I have 10-12 days to fill in mid-June and a friend and I are hoping to make a road trip to the Copper Canyon region, entering Mexico at Juarez and driving to Creel. I've been lurking here for some time and have found lots of helpful info and advice. However, in putting together a possible itinerary, a whole slew of questions have come to mind that I haven't found clear answers to elsewhere, hence this post. Any answers or feedback to any of the questions below will be very much appreciated. 1) Is it reasonable to drive from Nuevo Casas Grandes to Basaseachic Falls via Highways 10, 28, 23 and 16 (via Madera and La Junta) in one day? How are the road conditions? Estimated time to drive this stretch? 2) At Basaseachic Falls, we probably won't be making the six-hour round trip hike to the base of the falls. But I understand there are some good viewpoints without making the entire hike. True? 3) What are the chances in mid-June of arriving in Creel without room reservations and getting a place to stay? I've found a couple of places on the Net (Best Western, Villa Mexicana) that can be reserved on-line, but they are pricey. I have phone numbers of several other places in Creel that are probably more reasonable. Anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? Or, again, are reservations even advisable for that time of year? 4) We'd like to take the train into the canyons perhaps as far as Temoris or Bahuichivo to spend at least one night. Is it possible to just go to the station in Creel before the train leaves and get tickets on the spot? There are outfits in the US that will make reservations and sell tickets but only for first class. We are fine with second class. 5) Once in Temoris or Bahuichivo, what is the ease of getting lodging (clean room, private bath, if possible)? Reservations recommended? Can those arrangements be made once in Creel, or is it better to book something farther in advance? 6) We'd like to take an overnight (at least) bus excursion to Batopilas. From what I've read, it seems easy enough to arrange a trip from any hotel in Creel. True? 7) Should there be any problem finding a place to stay in Batopilas in mid-June? Or are accommodations booked as part of the bus trip or separately? If separately, any recommendations of places to stay? Reservations advised/necessary? Sorry for the long post and all the questions. And many thanks in advance for any answers and advice! Happy travels to all, Bart |
#8
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
Many thanks again, Dennis, for the additional information and for clarifying
the fact that there are two distinct trains, one for each class. You've been a huge help. It seems you've traveled a lot by road through much of Mexico, so here's another question for you: Would you have any idea if the trip from Nuevo Casas Grandes to Basaseachic could be comfortably done in one day? I am planning to go via Madera and La Junta, Hwys. 10, 28, 23, and 16. Kilometer-wise it looks very doable, but do you know anything about the road conditions or other possible delays on that route? Nuevamente gracias mil. Muy amable! Bart "Technobarbarian" wrote in message news:4OO8c.5195$Q45.323@fed1read02... "Bad Bart" wrote in message . com... I have a couple of further questions about the train: Just to clarify, when you said that tickets are "sold on the train as a matter of course," you meant that second class tickets can be bought right on the spot prior to departure, yes? In Creel you actually buy tickets from the conducter after you've boarded the train. The conducter comes around with a handheld electronic device that prints out the tickets. Tickets are not sold at the station. They are sold at the station in Los Mochis. And is it correct that there are two distinct trains, one first class and the other second? (I had been thinking there was only one train each way each day with both first- and second-class cars.) There are two distinct trains that travel about an hour apart, with the first class train in the lead. Also do you know if Creel has an ATM? You know, there must be one there somewhere, but I don't remember seeing it, or a bank. Pretty much every bank in Mexico has an ATM, but I don't recall having seen either in Creel. Dennis |
#9
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
Don,
Thanks for the recommendation on the stretch after Temoris. It sounds like an amazing ride! Another question for you: Is the train stop at Divisadero the only one that is long enough for getting some good pictures of the canyons, or are there plenty of other photo ops along the way, both from the train or at the various stops? Many thanks again. Your experience is very helpful. Bart "Donald Hazle" wrote in message om... Bart, I should mention that the it is the hour and 30 minutes after Temoris that is real good. After that the the remainder of the trip into El Fuerte is flat but still somewhat interesting. Since you are going in summer it still be light at that time... it was dark for us. Don "Bad Bart" wrote in message .com... Thanks, Don, for your reply. Your observation about hotel space in Creel and the canyon is encouraging. I appreciated your mention of the scenery between Temoris and El Fuerte. I am now considering extending the rail portion of the trip to El Fuerte, BTW, I enjoyed your report of your trip in your earlier post!. Many thanks again, Bart "Donald Hazle" wrote in message om... Bart, I can answer a few of your questions. #3 We were there two weeks ago and nothing was filled expect the hotels in El Furte. The hotels in the canyon and Creel appeared to have plenty of room. Our guide said that business was off about 30% for the last 2 years. However he said that the Mexicans normally come to the canyon in the summer. If you are going only to Temoris you will be on the second class train. The first class train does not stop there. Your will also miss some of the best scenery between Temoris and El Furte. I saw several hotel bus tours. But will they run in the heat of summer... I just don't know. Don Hazle "Bad Bart" wrote in message .com... Hello! I have 10-12 days to fill in mid-June and a friend and I are hoping to make a road trip to the Copper Canyon region, entering Mexico at Juarez and driving to Creel. I've been lurking here for some time and have found lots of helpful info and advice. However, in putting together a possible itinerary, a whole slew of questions have come to mind that I haven't found clear answers to elsewhere, hence this post. Any answers or feedback to any of the questions below will be very much appreciated. 1) Is it reasonable to drive from Nuevo Casas Grandes to Basaseachic Falls via Highways 10, 28, 23 and 16 (via Madera and La Junta) in one day? How are the road conditions? Estimated time to drive this stretch? 2) At Basaseachic Falls, we probably won't be making the six-hour round trip hike to the base of the falls. But I understand there are some good viewpoints without making the entire hike. True? 3) What are the chances in mid-June of arriving in Creel without room reservations and getting a place to stay? I've found a couple of places on the Net (Best Western, Villa Mexicana) that can be reserved on-line, but they are pricey. I have phone numbers of several other places in Creel that are probably more reasonable. Anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? Or, again, are reservations even advisable for that time of year? 4) We'd like to take the train into the canyons perhaps as far as Temoris or Bahuichivo to spend at least one night. Is it possible to just go to the station in Creel before the train leaves and get tickets on the spot? There are outfits in the US that will make reservations and sell tickets but only for first class. We are fine with second class. 5) Once in Temoris or Bahuichivo, what is the ease of getting lodging (clean room, private bath, if possible)? Reservations recommended? Can those arrangements be made once in Creel, or is it better to book something farther in advance? 6) We'd like to take an overnight (at least) bus excursion to Batopilas. From what I've read, it seems easy enough to arrange a trip from any hotel in Creel. True? 7) Should there be any problem finding a place to stay in Batopilas in mid-June? Or are accommodations booked as part of the bus trip or separately? If separately, any recommendations of places to stay? Reservations advised/necessary? Sorry for the long post and all the questions. And many thanks in advance for any answers and advice! Happy travels to all, Bart |
#10
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Copper Canyon Road Trip Questions
"Bad Bart" wrote in message news It seems you've traveled a lot by road through much of Mexico, so here's another question for you: Would you have any idea if the trip from Nuevo Casas Grandes to Basaseachic could be comfortably done in one day? I am planning to go via Madera and La Junta, Hwys. 10, 28, 23, and 16. Kilometer-wise it looks very doable, but do you know anything about the road conditions or other possible delays on that route? The only time I drove through there we went Nuevo Casas Grandes to Cuautemoc to Creel and then Basaseachic, so I haven't seen some of the road you're asking about. It looks doable on my map too, but you're skipping by the Menonite country near Cuauhtemoc. It's mildly interesting and you can pick up some of their justly famous cheese. Our (abysmal) guidebook said you could tour the cheese factories. This is not true, but you can peek in through the windows on technology that hasn't been generally used in the States for over 30 years. Seeing ethnic Germans living in Mexico and retaining their culture is a wonderful cultural disconnect. Their restaurants are an interesting blend of cultures. I would also add that what looks doable in the Guia Roji atlas can be very different from what you actually find. I've taken some drives that way that were interesting, but not what I expected. You should also consider slowing down to take a look at some of the little sawmills along the way. I saw some on the road to Basaseachic very similar to a small mill I had helped operate as a museum artifact. The only real difference being that they had replaced the steam engine with a gas or diesel engine. The rest of it was the same late 1800's technology that we had used. You'll also see some modern portable mills operating as commercial ventures in that area. Even the larger mills in the region are a technology that began disappearing over 50 years ago in the States. As you're going to be in Nuevo Casas Grandes I assume you're planning on seeing Paquime. It's possible to pick up Mata Ortiz style pottery near the ruins at reasonable prices. The stuff basically comes in two grades. Items made for the tourist trade will have thicker walls and won't be particularly well finished inside. The collector grade stuff will have thin walls and a nice finish inside. As it looks just as good outside the tourist grade stuff is fine with me. Anyone who thinks their collector grade stuff is going to appreciate in value in their lifetime is kidding themselves, even if they buy from famous artists in Mata Ortiz. There's just too much of it. You'll see amazing prices on Mata Ortiz potter in the States. In Mexico you'll have to shop around and bargain to get the best prices. Some of the towns in that area were founded and mostly populated by Mormons. They're also interesting in their differences from the rest of Mexico. The houses often reflect more American tastes. Mata Ortiz itself is also mildly interesting, if you have a car capable of the trip. The last twelve miles or so is gravel road. It looks like it's generally well maintained by you have to cross a creek with a gravel bottom and no bridge to get to it. There are two crossings. The upper one is easier. I suspect some of the locals like to send tourists to the lower one as some sort of local joke. There's an old ranch house that was once the center of a huge ranching empire about half way there. Mata Ortiz was once the home of a very large sawmill. Other than the potters it's now a pretty sleepy place. You would, of course, meet a lot of potters there and get to see a lot of pottery. Dennis |
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