Lengthening, of Enchantment of the Seas!

In article . net,
Benjamin Smith wrote:

My views are those of a customer. I don't claim to have business
knowledge.

But you are not the typical customer. The mass market cruise lines are
selling to the typical customer.

--
Charles

In article . net,
Benjamin Smith wrote:

My views are those of a customer. I don't claim to have business
knowledge.

But you are not the typical customer. The mass market cruise lines are
selling to the typical customer.

--
Charles

"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message
nk.net...

Also, in Europe buses have lots of prestige and Mercedes makes very
luxurious buses.

As for categories shifting, I agree. But, would you agree with me that
we should have our antennae up when category rungs get watered down?


Yes. But it's also more fun to get a little watered down 4 times a year,
than twice a year at old prices.

I still remember that our Century sailing back around 1996 was more than
twice what we're paying today.

Was the food better back then? Sure! We know that.

Was the service better back then? No, not really. Our one waiter on Connie
was an aberration. The only bad waiter on 8 Celebrity sailings. A few
months later on Zenith our waiter was great. Wish I didn't have to cancel
my Galaxy Rome sailing so I could have seen how the food and service were on
that ship.

Would I rather pay half the price and have to grind my own pepper? Now
that's the crux of the matter.

For some, money may not matter. For others... it does. Especially if you
have a son who's thinking Ivy League.

I think I'll take today's prices and grind my own pepper.

--Tom

"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message
nk.net...

Also, in Europe buses have lots of prestige and Mercedes makes very
luxurious buses.

As for categories shifting, I agree. But, would you agree with me that
we should have our antennae up when category rungs get watered down?


Yes. But it's also more fun to get a little watered down 4 times a year,
than twice a year at old prices.

I still remember that our Century sailing back around 1996 was more than
twice what we're paying today.

Was the food better back then? Sure! We know that.

Was the service better back then? No, not really. Our one waiter on Connie
was an aberration. The only bad waiter on 8 Celebrity sailings. A few
months later on Zenith our waiter was great. Wish I didn't have to cancel
my Galaxy Rome sailing so I could have seen how the food and service were on
that ship.

Would I rather pay half the price and have to grind my own pepper? Now
that's the crux of the matter.

For some, money may not matter. For others... it does. Especially if you
have a son who's thinking Ivy League.

I think I'll take today's prices and grind my own pepper.

--Tom

"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message
nk.net...

Also, in Europe buses have lots of prestige and Mercedes makes very
luxurious buses.

As for categories shifting, I agree. But, would you agree with me that
we should have our antennae up when category rungs get watered down?


Yes. But it's also more fun to get a little watered down 4 times a year,
than twice a year at old prices.

I still remember that our Century sailing back around 1996 was more than
twice what we're paying today.

Was the food better back then? Sure! We know that.

Was the service better back then? No, not really. Our one waiter on Connie
was an aberration. The only bad waiter on 8 Celebrity sailings. A few
months later on Zenith our waiter was great. Wish I didn't have to cancel
my Galaxy Rome sailing so I could have seen how the food and service were on
that ship.

Would I rather pay half the price and have to grind my own pepper? Now
that's the crux of the matter.

For some, money may not matter. For others... it does. Especially if you
have a son who's thinking Ivy League.

I think I'll take today's prices and grind my own pepper.

--Tom

Charles wrote:

In article . net,
Benjamin Smith wrote:


My views are those of a customer. I don't claim to have business
knowledge.


But you are not the typical customer. The mass market cruise lines are
selling to the typical customer.


My comments go in two areas. For the typical customer I'm in the camp
that wants to address nickel and diming and homogeneity. I'd like to
hear people brainstorm for (profitable and effective) alternative means
of revenue to art auctions and inch of gold sales. Also, is there a
sizable market for smaller ships in the mass market?

For the smaller subset of customers I'm one of the voices identifying a
declining standard for premium mass market and a hole that is present in
a product between the premium mass market and the luxury lines. I think
it is possible that as premium mass market cruisers get more cruises
under their belt they may want to move up the next notch, but not quite
up to Radissson or Crystal. And there's where the hole is present.

Ben S.

Tom & Linda wrote:

"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message
nk.net...

Also, in Europe buses have lots of prestige and Mercedes makes very
luxurious buses.

As for categories shifting, I agree. But, would you agree with me that
we should have our antennae up when category rungs get watered down?



Yes. But it's also more fun to get a little watered down 4 times a year,
than twice a year at old prices.

Not for me. I'd rather go once and get a great experience vs. 4 times
and get a so-so one.

I still remember that our Century sailing back around 1996 was more than
twice what we're paying today.

Was the food better back then? Sure! We know that.

Was the service better back then? No, not really. Our one waiter on Connie
was an aberration. The only bad waiter on 8 Celebrity sailings. A few
months later on Zenith our waiter was great. Wish I didn't have to cancel
my Galaxy Rome sailing so I could have seen how the food and service were on
that ship.


I think he was an aberration as well. What I wonder about is if the
staff is spread thin due to the wait staff having to serve more tables
and how common this is.

Would I rather pay half the price and have to grind my own pepper? Now
that's the crux of the matter.

For some, money may not matter. For others... it does. Especially if you
have a son who's thinking Ivy League.


Good point. Also a daughter that likes Ritz-Carlton and demands you by
the Volvo SUV I guess it is true that you could sail other lines at
the low price if you want value, bang for buck cruises.

I think I'll take today's prices and grind my own pepper.


Tom, do you think Celebrity can get some of the quality of food back if
it concentrated its budget and priorities on food and not Cirque de
Soleil? Carnival's food has improved, so it can be done on ships the
size of Celeb's ships in today's market.

But, to tell you the truth, I'd like to see Celebrity go with a 50,000
ton new Zenith with balconies and charge a percentage more for her. Just
a trial. Bring back the old standards of food and lack of obvious
revenue enhancers and see how much she'd draw. Or, they could have
bought one of the ex Ren ships.

Ben S.

--Tom

Tom & Linda wrote:

"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message
nk.net...

Also, in Europe buses have lots of prestige and Mercedes makes very
luxurious buses.

As for categories shifting, I agree. But, would you agree with me that
we should have our antennae up when category rungs get watered down?



Yes. But it's also more fun to get a little watered down 4 times a year,
than twice a year at old prices.

Not for me. I'd rather go once and get a great experience vs. 4 times
and get a so-so one.

I still remember that our Century sailing back around 1996 was more than
twice what we're paying today.

Was the food better back then? Sure! We know that.

Was the service better back then? No, not really. Our one waiter on Connie
was an aberration. The only bad waiter on 8 Celebrity sailings. A few
months later on Zenith our waiter was great. Wish I didn't have to cancel
my Galaxy Rome sailing so I could have seen how the food and service were on
that ship.


I think he was an aberration as well. What I wonder about is if the
staff is spread thin due to the wait staff having to serve more tables
and how common this is.

Would I rather pay half the price and have to grind my own pepper? Now
that's the crux of the matter.

For some, money may not matter. For others... it does. Especially if you
have a son who's thinking Ivy League.


Good point. Also a daughter that likes Ritz-Carlton and demands you by
the Volvo SUV I guess it is true that you could sail other lines at
the low price if you want value, bang for buck cruises.

I think I'll take today's prices and grind my own pepper.


Tom, do you think Celebrity can get some of the quality of food back if
it concentrated its budget and priorities on food and not Cirque de
Soleil? Carnival's food has improved, so it can be done on ships the
size of Celeb's ships in today's market.

But, to tell you the truth, I'd like to see Celebrity go with a 50,000
ton new Zenith with balconies and charge a percentage more for her. Just
a trial. Bring back the old standards of food and lack of obvious
revenue enhancers and see how much she'd draw. Or, they could have
bought one of the ex Ren ships.

Ben S.

--Tom

Tom & Linda wrote:

"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message
nk.net...

Also, in Europe buses have lots of prestige and Mercedes makes very
luxurious buses.

As for categories shifting, I agree. But, would you agree with me that
we should have our antennae up when category rungs get watered down?



Yes. But it's also more fun to get a little watered down 4 times a year,
than twice a year at old prices.

Not for me. I'd rather go once and get a great experience vs. 4 times
and get a so-so one.

I still remember that our Century sailing back around 1996 was more than
twice what we're paying today.

Was the food better back then? Sure! We know that.

Was the service better back then? No, not really. Our one waiter on Connie
was an aberration. The only bad waiter on 8 Celebrity sailings. A few
months later on Zenith our waiter was great. Wish I didn't have to cancel
my Galaxy Rome sailing so I could have seen how the food and service were on
that ship.


I think he was an aberration as well. What I wonder about is if the
staff is spread thin due to the wait staff having to serve more tables
and how common this is.

Would I rather pay half the price and have to grind my own pepper? Now
that's the crux of the matter.

For some, money may not matter. For others... it does. Especially if you
have a son who's thinking Ivy League.


Good point. Also a daughter that likes Ritz-Carlton and demands you by
the Volvo SUV I guess it is true that you could sail other lines at
the low price if you want value, bang for buck cruises.

I think I'll take today's prices and grind my own pepper.


Tom, do you think Celebrity can get some of the quality of food back if
it concentrated its budget and priorities on food and not Cirque de
Soleil? Carnival's food has improved, so it can be done on ships the
size of Celeb's ships in today's market.

But, to tell you the truth, I'd like to see Celebrity go with a 50,000
ton new Zenith with balconies and charge a percentage more for her. Just
a trial. Bring back the old standards of food and lack of obvious
revenue enhancers and see how much she'd draw. Or, they could have
bought one of the ex Ren ships.

Ben S.

--Tom

"Benjamin Smith" wrote in message
news
Tom & Linda wrote:

Tom, do you think Celebrity can get some of the quality of food back if
it concentrated its budget and priorities on food and not Cirque de
Soleil?

I would like to think so. But that's not where management seems to be
taking the product.

Carnival's food has improved,

Fleet wide? Not from all indications. To make a blanket statement may not
be correct, simply because a few people say it's better on Spirit Class
ships. What about all the Fantasy class ships? Will you find the same food
on Ecstasy as on the Spirit?


so it can be done on ships the
size of Celeb's ships in today's market.

But, to tell you the truth, I'd like to see Celebrity go with a 50,000
ton new Zenith with balconies and charge a percentage more for her. Just
a trial.

Expensive trial. $300 million experiment?

Though in truth... if you want balconies, and want Bermuda, and are willing
to pay more, why not just go with Radisson?

Bring back the old standards of food and lack of obvious
revenue enhancers and see how much she'd draw. Or, they could have
bought one of the ex Ren ships.

That would have been a good idea IMO. Even if not for Bermuda, but for some
of the "new" type things they're trying.

--Tom