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Travel-route suggestions for Australia?



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 16th, 2003, 11:43 AM
Jason
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Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?

On Tue, 16 Sep 2003 05:27:35 +0000, Hallvard Tangeraas wrote:

And suggestions for a travel route.. I realize that I've left out all of
western Australia, where I intended to start my trip in Perth. But
someone told me that Perth is so far from everything else that I'll
spend ages going through the outback, not being worth it as I can see so
much more at those other places mentioned here. Opinions?


When I did my first trip, I took 3 months to do the circle from Sydney -
Melbourne - Adelaide - Alice - Darwin - Cairns and then east coast down
back to Sydney. You could do this in 2.5 months. I think 2 months would be
a bit rushed.

If you can get internal flights, the bit I would definitely fly would be
from Darwin to Cairns. It's a long way. And there's not a whole lot to
see. I did it once on a bus. It took 32.5 hours. It's not an experience
I'd wish to repeat.

As for Perth, well if you can fly in there, spend a week and then fly onto
somewhere else, it might be worth doing. I certainly wouldn't go north of
Perth on your first trip. Again there isn't an awful lot there other than
the tourist trap of Monkey Mia apart from some nice diving on the Ningaloo
reef.

Jason

--
http://www.scuba-addict.co.uk/ for Aussie diving reports including
the Coral Sea, Ningaloo reef, the Solitaries and Byron Bay

  #2  
Old September 16th, 2003, 03:10 PM
Peter Webb
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Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?


"Jason" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 16 Sep 2003 05:27:35 +0000, Hallvard Tangeraas wrote:

And suggestions for a travel route.. I realize that I've left out all of
western Australia, where I intended to start my trip in Perth. But
someone told me that Perth is so far from everything else that I'll
spend ages going through the outback, not being worth it as I can see so
much more at those other places mentioned here. Opinions?


When I did my first trip, I took 3 months to do the circle from Sydney -
Melbourne - Adelaide - Alice - Darwin - Cairns and then east coast down
back to Sydney. You could do this in 2.5 months. I think 2 months would be
a bit rushed.

Cut out Melbourne and Adelaide. They are great cities, but on an itinerary
that includes Thailand, Indonesia, Japan, USA in 6 months they are somewhat
of an anticlimax.


If you can get internal flights, the bit I would definitely fly would be
from Darwin to Cairns. It's a long way. And there's not a whole lot to
see. I did it once on a bus. It took 32.5 hours. It's not an experience
I'd wish to repeat.


Basically, fly around the inside bits whenever you can. The desert is nice
and interesting for an hour or two, but there really is an awful lot of it
in the interior of Australia.

You will presumably be arriving in December and leaving Jan/Feb. The
northern half of Australia (including Cairns and Darwin) is tropical; you
will be there in the middle of the wet (monsoon) season. Expect 35 degree
heat and 100% humidity 24 hours a day. The more southern parts (Brisbane,
Perth, Sydney) will be hot but not nearly as wet.

When you arrive in Sydney, find somewhere to stay near the beach (Bondi
Beach is big backpacker scene). A hot summer day in Sydney, on the beach,
cold beer in the hand, topless girls all around, sucking oysters off the
shell ... think I might go in for another surf before I get too toasted ...
mmm, Sydney summer.



As for Perth, well if you can fly in there, spend a week and then fly onto
somewhere else, it might be worth doing. I certainly wouldn't go north of
Perth on your first trip. Again there isn't an awful lot there other than
the tourist trap of Monkey Mia apart from some nice diving on the Ningaloo
reef.

Jason

--
http://www.scuba-addict.co.uk/ for Aussie diving reports including
the Coral Sea, Ningaloo reef, the Solitaries and Byron Bay



  #4  
Old September 16th, 2003, 09:10 PM
Anette
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?

"Raffi Balmanoukian" a
"Jason" wrote in message
And suggestions for a travel route.. I realize that I've left out all

of
western Australia, where I intended to start my trip in Perth. But
someone told me that Perth is so far from everything else that I'll
spend ages going through the outback, not being worth it as I can see

so
much more at those other places mentioned here. Opinions?

When I did my first trip, I took 3 months to do the circle from

Sydney -
Melbourne - Adelaide - Alice - Darwin - Cairns and then east coast down
back to Sydney. You could do this in 2.5 months. I think 2 months would

be
a bit rushed.


Cut out Melbourne and Adelaide. They are great cities, but on an

itinerary
that includes Thailand, Indonesia, Japan, USA in 6 months they are

somewhat
of an anticlimax.


I disagree. Cut out Sydney and Cairns. Adelaide has a quiet charm not
found in most other Aussie cities and Melbourne is much more interesting
than Sydney. You will have plenty of diving and aqua and tropical
opportunities in Asia, so Cairns might have some duplication.


You've got to be kidding?? Cut out Sydney?? Sydney is by far the ultimate
Australian city for visitors!!! Melbourne is lovely, but Adelaide is
uninteresting and dead....

Anette


  #5  
Old September 17th, 2003, 01:43 AM
Peter Webb
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Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?


I disagree. Cut out Sydney and Cairns. Adelaide has a quiet charm not
found in most other Aussie cities and Melbourne is much more interesting
than Sydney. You will have plenty of diving and aqua and tropical
opportunities in Asia, so Cairns might have some duplication.


I know you are trying to be provocative, but maybe the OP doesn't.

Melbourne is a great place, as I said. I grew up there, apart from anything
else. But I am struggling to find any unique or special thing that it has
that sets it apart from other big Western cities. There is some nice civic
architecture - the so called "Paris end of Collins Street" - but a few
blocks of nice buildings that could be in Europe is not enough tp drag me
1,000 kms south from Sydney. To suggest that a Norwegian tourist in
Australia in summer should be in Melbourne rather than Sydney (a great party
city, with the world's best beaches) is ludicrous.

Adelaide is also nice. Des Moines and Tulsa are also nice, and about the
same size as Adelaide. Are you visitting them when you are in the States?

Cairns is one of the few tropical Western cities in the world. It is also
the only place in the world where two world heritage sites adjoin (the
rainforest and the reef). It is unique. Similarly, there is no city like
Sydney in the world. Finally, they lie at opposite ends of a 3,000 kms
stretch of the QLD and NSW coast that includes the Great Barrier Reef,
hundreds of islands and attols, interesting tropical hinterland, knock-out
beaches and communities (Byron Bay, Noosa, Nimbin, Mullumbimby ...). Sydney
is a must see destination if you visit Australia; if you are here for more
than a few weeks, so is Cairns. Melbourne and Adelaide are not.







  #6  
Old September 17th, 2003, 09:52 AM
Jason
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Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?

On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:43:15 +1000, Peter Webb wrote:

architecture - the so called "Paris end of Collins Street" - but a few
blocks of nice buildings that could be in Europe is not enough tp drag
me 1,000 kms south from Sydney. To suggest that a Norwegian tourist in


Maybe it's just me, but I don't tend to spend that long in the cities
anyway. On my last trip I spent a night in Sydney before heading off into
the Blue Mountains.

There are plenty of things to go south for, like the Great Ocean
Road, Ballarat gold fields, Barossa valley, Coober Pedy, to name but a
few. And if you're backpacking, you quickly start to think very little
about hopping on a bus for the night. I spent a very enjoyable 14 days
just driving from Sydney to Melbourne via places like the Snowy Mountains
and the Grampians. Apart from anything else, it was nice to get off the
backpacker circuit.

Cairns is one of the few tropical Western cities in the world. It is
also the only place in the world where two world heritage sites adjoin
(the rainforest and the reef). It is unique. Similarly, there is no city
like


Cairns is alright IMO. The reef isn't very good there. There are plenty of
places to dive or snorkel where it's better. The viz isn't that good and I
noticed a lot of dead staghorn coral last time I was there, probably due
to run off.

It is a good place to go out for a few drinks, but there are loads of
places like that on the east coast. You can end up going out every night
and spending a fortune, and many backpackers seem to do just that.

Sydney in the world. Finally, they lie at opposite ends of a 3,000 kms
stretch of the QLD and NSW coast that includes the Great Barrier Reef,
hundreds of islands and attols, interesting tropical hinterland,


Nitpicking, but I think the only atolls are a couple of hundred miles way
out in the Coral Sea. I agree with Byron though wouldn't go there are New
Year again. It gets far too busy. And there's Fraser Island of course.

Jason

--
http://www.scuba-addict.co.uk/ for Aussie diving reports including
Cape Tribulation, Cairns, Airlie Beach, Exmouth and the HMAS Swan

  #7  
Old September 17th, 2003, 02:19 PM
Peter Webb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?


"Jason" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:43:15 +1000, Peter Webb wrote:

architecture - the so called "Paris end of Collins Street" - but a few
blocks of nice buildings that could be in Europe is not enough tp drag
me 1,000 kms south from Sydney. To suggest that a Norwegian tourist in


Maybe it's just me, but I don't tend to spend that long in the cities
anyway. On my last trip I spent a night in Sydney before heading off into
the Blue Mountains.

That was a pity. Really.


There are plenty of things to go south for, like the Great Ocean
Road, Ballarat gold fields, Barossa valley, Coober Pedy, to name but a
few. And if you're backpacking, you quickly start to think very little
about hopping on a bus for the night. I spent a very enjoyable 14 days
just driving from Sydney to Melbourne via places like the Snowy Mountains
and the Grampians. Apart from anything else, it was nice to get off the
backpacker circuit.


Yeah, these are all quite good. Haven't seen most of these since I was a
kid. Living here, you tend to fly between places and miss the bits in
between - all the places you mentioned are "in between places" - not
somewhere you would specially go to, but certainly places worth seeing if
you are driving through.

I am impressed that you have been to these places - I gather you are a pom -
there wouldn't be that many Australians who have done all of them. But then
again, you have to question the mindset of somebody who talks down Sydney
and talks up Ballarat. (As in "Don't bother visiting London. For a really
good time, go straight to Sheffield").


Cairns is one of the few tropical Western cities in the world. It is
also the only place in the world where two world heritage sites adjoin
(the rainforest and the reef). It is unique. Similarly, there is no city
like


Cairns is alright IMO. The reef isn't very good there. There are plenty of
places to dive or snorkel where it's better. The viz isn't that good and I
noticed a lot of dead staghorn coral last time I was there, probably due
to run off.


The reef is great there. If the viz was poor, that was just the weather; it
can range from 10 feet to 150 feet depending on where and when. Dead
staghorn coral on fringing reefs may be due to run-off; if it was on the
outer reef it was almost certainly localised storm damage. I agree that
there is 2,000 kms of reef, and it doesn't much matter where you go on it -
but Cairns does have really well developed infrastructure, and has
attractions beyond the reef itself (eg rainforest, hippie communities,
access to Cape York, cane toad races, etc).


It is a good place to go out for a few drinks, but there are loads of
places like that on the east coast. You can end up going out every night
and spending a fortune, and many backpackers seem to do just that.

Sydney in the world. Finally, they lie at opposite ends of a 3,000 kms
stretch of the QLD and NSW coast that includes the Great Barrier Reef,
hundreds of islands and attols, interesting tropical hinterland,


Nitpicking, but I think the only atolls are a couple of hundred miles way
out in the Coral Sea. I agree with Byron though wouldn't go there are New
Year again. It gets far too busy. And there's Fraser Island of course.


I have actually stayed on two of the atolls on the reef (the only two with
permanent facilities, although there are many unihabitated atolls) - Lady
Elliot Island (at the very south, and very cheap), and Lizard island (at the
very north, and very expensive). Both feature unbelievable diving.

Fraser I detest. My parents live about 30 minutes drive away. For me, its a
sand superhighway with idiots in 4 wheel drives screaming past at 130 kms an
hour while you try and enjoy the beach. In December/January the sun is
directly overhead, you are surrounded entirely by white sand, and the
glare/sunburn factor is astronomical. If you want to lie on a pretty white
beach, there's another 1,000 kms of them between Noosa and Sydney, and they
don't have idiots in 4WDs trying to run you over.

I would imagine that if you are a backpacking Norwegian tourist, you would
want to be somewhere busy on New Years eve. I guess that is a question for
the OP.


Jason

--
http://www.scuba-addict.co.uk/ for Aussie diving reports including
Cape Tribulation, Cairns, Airlie Beach, Exmouth and the HMAS Swan


Mmmm ... Airlie Beach.

Peter Webb



  #8  
Old September 17th, 2003, 04:30 PM
Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?

On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 23:19:17 +1000, Peter Webb wrote:

Yeah, these are all quite good. Haven't seen most of these since I was a
kid. Living here, you tend to fly between places and miss the bits in
between - all the places you mentioned are "in between places" - not
somewhere you would specially go to, but certainly places worth seeing if
you are driving through.


Which is the exact opposite of what you do when you're backpacking. You
stop at most of them along the way.

there wouldn't be that many Australians who have done all of them. But then
again, you have to question the mindset of somebody who talks down Sydney
and talks up Ballarat. (As in "Don't bother visiting London. For a really
good time, go straight to Sheffield").


I didn't say don't visit Sydney. I've just been there a couple of times before,
and done most of the obvious attractions.

The reef is great there. If the viz was poor, that was just the weather; it
can range from 10 feet to 150 feet depending on where and when. Dead
staghorn coral on fringing reefs may be due to run-off; if it was on the
outer reef it was almost certainly localised storm damage. I agree that


You and I have a different definition of "great" then. When was the last
time you went there? I dived in 1998 and the reefs were fine. I then did a
trip last year that went north to the Ribbon Reefs and the Cod Hole. The
northern reefs were fine again, but as soon as you got as far south as
Port Douglas, the viz dropped and there was a lot of dead staghorn. And
these were some of the same places that I'd dived 4 years before.

Further south out of Airlie, the coral was in better shape.

But the really good diving is at places like Holmes Reef or Osprey, which
are much further out.

Jason

--
See http://www.scuba-addict.co.uk/ for trip reports including
the Costa Blanca, Gibraltar, Gran Canaria and the UK

  #9  
Old September 17th, 2003, 04:42 PM
Raffi Balmanoukian
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?

in article , Anette at
wrote on 9/16/03 5:10 PM:

"Raffi Balmanoukian" a
"Jason" wrote in message
And suggestions for a travel route.. I realize that I've left out all

of
western Australia, where I intended to start my trip in Perth. But
someone told me that Perth is so far from everything else that I'll
spend ages going through the outback, not being worth it as I can see

so
much more at those other places mentioned here. Opinions?

When I did my first trip, I took 3 months to do the circle from

Sydney -
Melbourne - Adelaide - Alice - Darwin - Cairns and then east coast down
back to Sydney. You could do this in 2.5 months. I think 2 months would

be
a bit rushed.

Cut out Melbourne and Adelaide. They are great cities, but on an

itinerary
that includes Thailand, Indonesia, Japan, USA in 6 months they are

somewhat
of an anticlimax.


I disagree. Cut out Sydney and Cairns. Adelaide has a quiet charm not
found in most other Aussie cities and Melbourne is much more interesting
than Sydney. You will have plenty of diving and aqua and tropical
opportunities in Asia, so Cairns might have some duplication.


You've got to be kidding?? Cut out Sydney?? Sydney is by far the ultimate
Australian city for visitors!!! Melbourne is lovely, but Adelaide is
uninteresting and dead....

Anette




Guess if we all thought the same, we wouldn't need assorted
biscuits....Sydney leaves me cold; Adelaide quite the opposite. But, that's
just me....

  #10  
Old September 18th, 2003, 02:16 PM
Anthony Bagnall
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Travel-route suggestions for Australia?

hi Peter,

I was interested in your comments about lady elliot and frasier, as I'm
planning a trip to that area (but no further north). Did you camp on lady
elliot? We are not diving but want to snorkel. Given we will have a max of 5
days in the area north of brisbane, would you miss frasier and go for a trip
to another island (or maybe I'll just hire a 4-wheel drive



"Peter Webb" wrote in message
u...

"Jason" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 10:43:15 +1000, Peter Webb wrote:

architecture - the so called "Paris end of Collins Street" - but a few
blocks of nice buildings that could be in Europe is not enough tp drag
me 1,000 kms south from Sydney. To suggest that a Norwegian tourist in


Maybe it's just me, but I don't tend to spend that long in the cities
anyway. On my last trip I spent a night in Sydney before heading off

into
the Blue Mountains.


That was a pity. Really.


There are plenty of things to go south for, like the Great Ocean
Road, Ballarat gold fields, Barossa valley, Coober Pedy, to name but a
few. And if you're backpacking, you quickly start to think very little
about hopping on a bus for the night. I spent a very enjoyable 14 days
just driving from Sydney to Melbourne via places like the Snowy

Mountains
and the Grampians. Apart from anything else, it was nice to get off the
backpacker circuit.


Yeah, these are all quite good. Haven't seen most of these since I was a
kid. Living here, you tend to fly between places and miss the bits in
between - all the places you mentioned are "in between places" - not
somewhere you would specially go to, but certainly places worth seeing if
you are driving through.

I am impressed that you have been to these places - I gather you are a

pom -
there wouldn't be that many Australians who have done all of them. But

then
again, you have to question the mindset of somebody who talks down Sydney
and talks up Ballarat. (As in "Don't bother visiting London. For a really
good time, go straight to Sheffield").


Cairns is one of the few tropical Western cities in the world. It is
also the only place in the world where two world heritage sites adjoin
(the rainforest and the reef). It is unique. Similarly, there is no

city
like


Cairns is alright IMO. The reef isn't very good there. There are plenty

of
places to dive or snorkel where it's better. The viz isn't that good and

I
noticed a lot of dead staghorn coral last time I was there, probably due
to run off.


The reef is great there. If the viz was poor, that was just the weather;

it
can range from 10 feet to 150 feet depending on where and when. Dead
staghorn coral on fringing reefs may be due to run-off; if it was on the
outer reef it was almost certainly localised storm damage. I agree that
there is 2,000 kms of reef, and it doesn't much matter where you go on

it -
but Cairns does have really well developed infrastructure, and has
attractions beyond the reef itself (eg rainforest, hippie communities,
access to Cape York, cane toad races, etc).


It is a good place to go out for a few drinks, but there are loads of
places like that on the east coast. You can end up going out every night
and spending a fortune, and many backpackers seem to do just that.

Sydney in the world. Finally, they lie at opposite ends of a 3,000 kms
stretch of the QLD and NSW coast that includes the Great Barrier Reef,
hundreds of islands and attols, interesting tropical hinterland,


Nitpicking, but I think the only atolls are a couple of hundred miles

way
out in the Coral Sea. I agree with Byron though wouldn't go there are

New
Year again. It gets far too busy. And there's Fraser Island of course.


I have actually stayed on two of the atolls on the reef (the only two with
permanent facilities, although there are many unihabitated atolls) - Lady
Elliot Island (at the very south, and very cheap), and Lizard island (at

the
very north, and very expensive). Both feature unbelievable diving.

Fraser I detest. My parents live about 30 minutes drive away. For me, its

a
sand superhighway with idiots in 4 wheel drives screaming past at 130 kms

an
hour while you try and enjoy the beach. In December/January the sun is
directly overhead, you are surrounded entirely by white sand, and the
glare/sunburn factor is astronomical. If you want to lie on a pretty white
beach, there's another 1,000 kms of them between Noosa and Sydney, and

they
don't have idiots in 4WDs trying to run you over.

I would imagine that if you are a backpacking Norwegian tourist, you would
want to be somewhere busy on New Years eve. I guess that is a question for
the OP.


Jason

--
http://www.scuba-addict.co.uk/ for Aussie diving reports including
Cape Tribulation, Cairns, Airlie Beach, Exmouth and the HMAS Swan


Mmmm ... Airlie Beach.

Peter Webb





 




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