Brooklyn Welcomes Cruise Ships!

In article , D Ball
wrote:

http://www.govisland.com/Images/View...and/Aerial.jpg

This is the one that shows why they won't go up and around. Pier 12 is
the long white structure on the left edge of the picture. Buttermilk
Channel - the waterway between Governor's Island and Red Hook is a
deep-water channel right into Atlantic Basin. The deep-water channel on
the harbor side is out of the picture and would require bringing the
ship through a very narrow channel betyween Governor's Island and
Manhattan, which is already very busy from all the ferry traffic in the
area.

In article , Alex L
wrote:

The deep-water channel on the harbor side is out of the picture and
would require bringing the ship through a very narrow channel
betyween Governor's Island and Manhattan, which is already very busy
from all the ferry traffic in the area.

Nevertheless I think they should and will go around that way.

--
Charles

"E.k.R." wrote in message
. ..

"Chrissy Cruiser" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 16 Apr 2005 11:54:08 -0400, E.k.R. wrote:

Why bother having different brands
if all you are going to do is dilute them?

B/c, Ernie, it is much simpler to have one business plan for a hundred
ships than ot have 100 business plans for 100 ships. Economies of scale,
Ole Chap.

Oh I fully understand economies of scale (my business degree comes in
handy every now and again), but I don't fully understand the purpose of
buying a distinctive brand if your eventual plan is to dilute it.

He, who dies with the most toys, wins.

On the other hand... it also keeps your enemies from getting that particular
toy if you buy it.

Bigger might not always be "better"... but it IS always "bigger".

--Tom

Surfer,
Thanks for letting me know. I'll call the realtor Monday morning and put the
house on the market immediately.
Bill
--
visit my Caribbean Princess website
http://www.cruisingthecaribbeanprincess.com

"Surfer E2468" wrote in message
...
What is the matter with philadelphia is just that it is a dirty,drug
infested city,and i am glad we had enough sense to move out 54 years ago

"Thomas Smith" -NO-SPAM wrote in message
...


"Sue and Kevin Mullen" wrote in message
...


Thomas Smith wrote:

Granted my New York geography is a bit lacking, but I pulled up maps of
the
area where the Brooklyn cruise ship terminal will be. If I am reading
this
right, it will be at Atlantic Ave. and Columbia St., right off exit 27
of
the BQE (I-278).

This sounds right, altho I don't know the exact street or exit for the
new terminal.

Folks from New Jersey can take I-278 across Staten Island
and the Verazano Narrows bridge, and end up going directly to the
terminal,

Those of us coming from NJ will go over the Outerbridge or Goethals
Bridges, both tolls and very often backed up. From there we take
I-278, better known locally as the Staten Island Expressway. This road
is also most often in lousy condition and very heavy, backed up
traffic. Then you get to the Verazano bridge, $7 toll last I remember
and backed up traffic most of the time. From there we go to the BQE
which is also famous for heavy congestion. It used to be in bad shape,
but that may of changes since I was last on it.


The Rand McNally Road Atlas shows the BQE under construction between the
Williamsburg Bridge and the junction with NY 27 (Prospect Expwy.)

The roads for us going to Bayonne or up to NYC are in better condition
and don't back up as much. Yes I know the Lincoln Tunnel can back up
and once you get to the pier in NYC you can sit for awhile in line.
This still is a much easier trip, then the one to the new Brooklyn
terminal will be.

unless traffic gets real fun at the Brooklyn Battery Tunnel (I-478)
right
there.

Coming from NJ, going through Brooklyn, you don't go thru the tunnel.
Traffic going to the tunnel can be fun, but I haven't experienced it
for many, many years.

Now, if you are coming from the north, you could take I-95 across
the George Washington Bridge, pick up the Deegan Expressway (I-87)
south
to
the Grand Central Parkway (I-278) towards LaGuardia (is that the
Tri-Borough
Bridge?), and follow I-278 as it becomes the BQE.

I am not as familiar with this route, but from north Jersey I would
probably take the Lincoln Tunnel into Manhattan and then the Brooklyn
Battery Tunnel into Brooklyn.

sue

What about the Holland Tunnel, and then the Manhattan Bridge, the Brooklyn
Bridge or the Brooklyn Battery Tunnel to get across the East River?


If you left on Friday, you might get there by Sunday evening.

--Tom

"Tom K" wrote in message
news


If you left on Friday, you might get there by Sunday evening.

--Tom



To paraphrase Yogi Berra, "traffic is so bad there, no one drives there
anymore."

--
I'm Tom Smith, and I approved this message.

"George Leppla" wrote in message
...

"Surfer E2468" wrote


Going out of red hook is like sailing from philadelphia,would have to
think several times about sailing from either one,do not want to take a
risk that big

The Philadelphia passenger terminal is part of the Philadelphia Naval
Base.
It is a military installation and as those things go, probably more secure
than most ports in terms of passenger safety and parking. I'm pretty
sure
from your post that you have never been there.

The terminal itself is a beautiful brick structure. You take a shuttle
bus
from teh parking lot (free) and when you arive, you are usually freeted by
either a Colonial Drum and FIfe Corps or a group of Mummers. Ben Franklin
is usually in attendance welcoming you to Philadelphia.

There are plenty of check-in stations and once you go through that, there
is
a new, modern walkway that takes you to the ship. Elevators and
escalators
are available.

It is a shame that there aren't more ships sailing out ofPhiladelphia
because it is a fine facilty that is run very well.


--
George in PA http://www.countryside-travel.com

Miracle in May - http://www.cruisemaster.com/miracle.htm
The Mother of All Group Cruises 2 - http://www.moagc2.com/



Wasn't the Philadelphia Naval Shipyard shut down several years ago?

--
I'm Tom Smith, and I approved this message.

"George Leppla" wrote in message
...

"Surfer E2468" wrote


Going out of red hook is like sailing from philadelphia,would have to
think several times about sailing from either one,do not want to take a
risk that big

The Philadelphia passenger terminal is part of the Philadelphia Naval
Base.
It is a military installation and as those things go, probably more secure
than most ports in terms of passenger safety and parking. I'm pretty
sure
from your post that you have never been there.

The terminal itself is a beautiful brick structure. You take a shuttle
bus
from teh parking lot (free) and when you arive, you are usually freeted by
either a Colonial Drum and FIfe Corps or a group of Mummers. Ben Franklin
is usually in attendance welcoming you to Philadelphia.

There are plenty of check-in stations and once you go through that, there
is
a new, modern walkway that takes you to the ship. Elevators and
escalators
are available.

It is a shame that there aren't more ships sailing out ofPhiladelphia
because it is a fine facilty that is run very well.


--
George in PA http://www.countryside-travel.com

Miracle in May - http://www.cruisemaster.com/miracle.htm
The Mother of All Group Cruises 2 - http://www.moagc2.com/



Wasn't the Philadelphia Naval Shipyard shut down several years ago?

--
I'm Tom Smith, and I approved this message.

"Thomas Smith" -NO-SPAM wrote

Wasn't the Philadelphia Naval Shipyard shut down several years ago?

Most of it was. There is still a section where they store decommissioned
ships and the Ship Systems Engineering Station is located there. IIRC, this
is an engineering/fabrication unit as well as other naval units. Some of
the property is being privatized.

If you are really interested, you can look at
http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...iladelphia.htm for more
info.


--
George in PA http://www.countryside-travel.com

Miracle in May - http://www.cruisemaster.com/miracle.htm
The Mother of All Group Cruises 2 - http://www.moagc2.com/

George Leppla wrote:
"Benjamin Smith" wrote


You're a wonderful mouthpiece for Carnival Corp., they must love you.


Ironically, I had a meeting with a Carnival Corp person yesterday and he
told me that I was too hard in my criticism of that company. Since I have
both ends of the spectrum covered, I figure I am doing something right by
pleasing the people in the middle... and those are my customers.


rtc doesn't see much criticism of Carnival by you. It is justification
for them providing what people want with you defining "people" as a
broad, lowest-common denominator generic contemporary cruise customer.
Frankly, I find your comments to be cliche and close to business apologist.


Fact is that I don't care what Carnival Corp thinks of me (if they bother to
think of me at all). My criteria for dealing with any cruise company is
that they provide my customers with a good value and customer satisfaction.
MY main purpose for being a travel agent is to make a profit and I do that
by matching the customer's needs and desires with a cruise line that will
deliver. The fact that I love what I do is a plus, but unless I make a
profit I wouldn't last very long.


No one is saying don't make a profit, that is not what this is about.

You dismiss what some of us have to say about how Carnival is making
lines they have acquired less desirable to their loyal, long-term fans,
and much less distinctive than the could or arguably should be. You say
we are out of touch but what we may be are people willing to take a
stand on core identities and execution of products.

There are long-term cruise fans that aren't satisfied with today's
generic product or are tepid to it. Lee's latest HAL review, Karen,
Ernie, Howie, rtcRef and others here and some who have taken one cruise
on a "premium" line and not finding it to match the advertising blurb's
descriptions or what they thought it might be aren't satisfied. Value is
something some want within reason but if it compromises quality some are
willing to pay more. If it means more peace of mind onboard without the
obvious nickel and diming, some are willing to pay a measure more.

btw, there are some travel agents whose main "purpose" is to provide a
service and stay in business by making a profit. My wife teaches piano
and makes a profit, but her main purpose is to guide others, especially
youngsters, to the phenomenon and wonder of music through the means of
the piano instrument, and thankfully she makes a good living out of it.



BTW - I think you would be hard pressed to cite many instance where I
"defend" Carnival.


My opinions are about what is happening, not whether it
is
good or bad. Personally, I see the evolution of the "ocean liner" industry
into the "cruise vacation" industry as a good thing.

That's fine, others have legitimate comments on the specifics of the
cruise vacation industry, which btw happened in the 1960s to 1970s.


I admire the business
acumen that Carnival Corp has to start a company from nothing and build it
into the major player in the industry today. I don't defend their tactics
or marketing strategies but I am smart enough to be able to separate the
hype from the product and guide my customers accordingly.


There's acumen, then there's going too far into bullying and market
domination and homogenization of the industry. Karen and Ernie certainly
know their products long term and what Carnival's directive have
transformed in their acquired products, and the hype Karen and Ernie
aren't buying is the hype coming from Carnival's marketing and
submarketing departments.

The difference I see between Karen and Ernie's views and yours is that
they think of various types of customers first, regardless of the size
of their market. You represent companies and their version of "customer
driven" moves which seeks to lump everyone together into a generic
batch. I don't see any guidance from you for those looking for an
alternative to the bigger, supermarket, variation-of-theme trends in all
brands and interchangeability of personnel operating mode of Carnival.

The problem. Bypass Carnival and its brands. Bypass RCI. But, this
duopoly of sorts is making it difficult for small startups to bring in
the type of products that those seeking alternatives to the Carnival and
RCI brand models to operate.

Ben S.