"How the EU works: In Germany, they make the rules, in Britain, theyobey the rules, in France, they bend the rules, in Spain, they break therules, and in Italy they have no rules at all."

On 11/20/2011 04:32 PM, Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:
Dan wrote
in news:2011112009132350813-stephedanospam@maccom:

On 2011-11-20 04:18:19 -0600, Wolfgang Schwanke said:

Or plough a hectare. Oh wait, is that a measure in System
Internationale?

Yes it is. An are is 10x10 meters. A hectare is 100 of those.

Actually, no, it is not. It is a division derived from the metric
system but it is an artificial construct so people could have a unit
that was something of a suitable size for farm land sizing, a purpose
previously served by the acre.

Nobody denies that some common metric units are deliberately tailored
to be close to ancient ones. I'm not sure about your acre theory
though, the hectare is also used in countries who never had the acre
unit.


However, the acre (Morgen) was used in Germany, and is apparently the
same size as the imperial acre. The word has not completely died out,
any more than the words for foot, inch, pound, ton and so on, which are
regularly used in everyday speech.

Incidentally, plumbing fittings in Germany are sold in imperial units -
half-inch. three-quarter inch etc.

I suspect this may be true in many countries in Europe.

On 11/21/2011 12:55 PM, Martin wrote:
On Mon, 21 Nov 2011 12:06:26 +0100, Tom wrote:

On 11/20/2011 04:32 PM, Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:
Dan wrote
in news:2011112009132350813-stephedanospam@maccom:

On 2011-11-20 04:18:19 -0600, Wolfgang Schwanke said:

Or plough a hectare. Oh wait, is that a measure in System
Internationale?

Yes it is. An are is 10x10 meters. A hectare is 100 of those.

Actually, no, it is not. It is a division derived from the metric
system but it is an artificial construct so people could have a unit
that was something of a suitable size for farm land sizing, a purpose
previously served by the acre.

Nobody denies that some common metric units are deliberately tailored
to be close to ancient ones. I'm not sure about your acre theory
though, the hectare is also used in countries who never had the acre
unit.


However, the acre (Morgen) was used in Germany, and is apparently the
same size as the imperial acre. The word has not completely died out,
any more than the words for foot, inch, pound, ton and so on, which are
regularly used in everyday speech.

Incidentally, plumbing fittings in Germany are sold in imperial units -
half-inch. three-quarter inch etc.

Marine plywood too, apparently because there are so many boat plans
that rely on optimised use of sheets of ply with UK measurements.
Tulips are still sown a foot apart because the original machines were
imported from UK.


True for wood lathing as well, which is typically sold in very strange
millimeter sizes that I suspect are really fractions of an inch.


I suspect this may be true in many countries in Europe.

On 11/21/2011 8:21 AM, Tom P wrote:
On 11/21/2011 12:55 PM, Martin wrote:
On Mon, 21 Nov 2011 12:06:26 +0100, Tom wrote:

On 11/20/2011 04:32 PM, Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:
Dan wrote
in news:2011112009132350813-stephedanospam@maccom:

On 2011-11-20 04:18:19 -0600, Wolfgang Schwanke said:

Or plough a hectare. Oh wait, is that a measure in System
Internationale?

Yes it is. An are is 10x10 meters. A hectare is 100 of those.

Actually, no, it is not. It is a division derived from the metric
system but it is an artificial construct so people could have a unit
that was something of a suitable size for farm land sizing, a purpose
previously served by the acre.

Nobody denies that some common metric units are deliberately tailored
to be close to ancient ones. I'm not sure about your acre theory
though, the hectare is also used in countries who never had the acre
unit.


However, the acre (Morgen) was used in Germany, and is apparently the
same size as the imperial acre. The word has not completely died out,
any more than the words for foot, inch, pound, ton and so on, which are
regularly used in everyday speech.

Incidentally, plumbing fittings in Germany are sold in imperial units -
half-inch. three-quarter inch etc.

Marine plywood too, apparently because there are so many boat plans
that rely on optimised use of sheets of ply with UK measurements.
Tulips are still sown a foot apart because the original machines were
imported from UK.


True for wood lathing as well, which is typically sold in very strange
millimeter sizes that I suspect are really fractions of an inch.


I suspect this may be true in many countries in Europe.



I know that "pfund" and "livre" are still used meaning 500g but what
other pre-metric names, apart from "tonne", are still in use and for
what? Are the plumbing and lathing fittings mentioned measured in actual
inches or are they close metric equivalents, say 12mm and 18mm, for half
and three quarters of an inch?

--


James Silverton, Potomac

I'm *not*

On 21/11/11 11:06, Tom P wrote:
On 11/20/2011 04:32 PM, Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:
Dan wrote
in news:2011112009132350813-stephedanospam@maccom:

On 2011-11-20 04:18:19 -0600, Wolfgang Schwanke said:

Or plough a hectare. Oh wait, is that a measure in System
Internationale?

Yes it is. An are is 10x10 meters. A hectare is 100 of those.

Actually, no, it is not. It is a division derived from the metric
system but it is an artificial construct so people could have a unit
that was something of a suitable size for farm land sizing, a purpose
previously served by the acre.

Nobody denies that some common metric units are deliberately tailored
to be close to ancient ones. I'm not sure about your acre theory
though, the hectare is also used in countries who never had the acre
unit.


However, the acre (Morgen) was used in Germany, and is apparently the
same size as the imperial acre. The word has not completely died out,
any more than the words for foot, inch, pound, ton and so on, which are
regularly used in everyday speech.

Incidentally, plumbing fittings in Germany are sold in imperial units -
half-inch. three-quarter inch etc.

I suspect this may be true in many countries in Europe.

Of course they are, in much the same way that almost all firearms and
artillery use imperial measurements transferred to metric.

7.62mm = .30 (the almost universal rifle calibre)

9mm = .36 (Which actually started with the old 'cap and ball' Colt pistol)

37mm = inch and a half (Maxim's 'light pompom' calibre)

55mm = two inches (Maxim's 'heavy pompom' calibre)

155mm = six inches (British naval gun size)

But everyone pretends they're not really imperial measurements...

What's really interesting is that British medium naval guns were 4.7
inches, which is 120mm...


--
William Black

Free men have open minds
If you want loyalty, buy a dog...

"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 21 Nov 2011 11:44:11 +0100, "Terry Richards"
wrote:


"S Viemeister" wrote in message
...
There were ha'pennies (half pennies), and farthings (quarter pennies).

There was a 1/3 farthing (1/12 of a penny) in Victorian times.


a groat.

I think that we should bring back the aureus (gold), the denarius (silver),
the sestertius (brass), the dupondius (brass), and the as (copper).

--
JohnT

On 2011-11-21 04:44:11 -0600, Terry Richards said:

"S Viemeister" wrote in message
...
There were ha'pennies (half pennies), and farthings (quarter pennies).

There was a 1/3 farthing (1/12 of a penny) in Victorian times.

See? Britons cannot help themselves, talking about pre-decimal money.

And it is cool from a historical perspective.

new question: which of these old coins were made of gold? I'm thinking
from the perspective of both collection and investment.
--
Dan Stephenson
http://web.mac.com/stepheda
Travel pages for Europe and the U.S.A. (and New Zealand too)

On 2011-11-21 04:42:47 -0600, Jesper Lauridsen said:

On 20 Nov., 16:17, Dan Stephenson wrote:
On 2011-11-20 03:54:22 -0600, Wolfgang Schwanke said:

Dan Stephenson wrote
innews:201111181919293211-stephedanospam@maccom:

The fly-ways on American interstate
highways are far superior than the mega-roundabouts on the British
four-lane carriageways,

What are fly-ways?

They are ramps and elevated roads that merge and separate traffic, so
that there is no slowing down at all.

This is the interchange nearest to my house:

http://g.co/maps/3kvfx

How does that differ from say: http://g.co/maps/957mj ?

That looks really interesting! Actually, most of the interchanges on
the motorways in Britain involve huge roundabouts that have traffic
lights on them. There was one particularly crazy roundabout, in
Swindon, iirc, that had planetary roundabouts on the perimeters of an
anti-clockwide central roundabout.

You link above looks like a roundaboutish variation on the "clover
leaf" method of traffic control. The downside on it, however, is that
traffic has crossing.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloverleaf_interchange

The "fly-ways" or "fly overs" only have one-direction merging.

Here is a somewhat famous interchange on the other side of Dallas:

http://g.co/maps/2pbg8

It is called the High 5 because it has five levels of traffic.

What do you know, there is a wikipedia page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Five_Interchange



--
Dan Stephenson
http://web.mac.com/stepheda
Travel pages for Europe and the U.S.A. (and New Zealand too)

On 2011-11-21 08:07:03 -0600, James Silverton said:

I suspect this may be true in many countries in Europe.



I know that "pfund" and "livre" are still used meaning 500g but what
other pre-metric names, apart from "tonne", are still in use and for
what? Are the plumbing and lathing fittings mentioned measured in
actual inches or are they close metric equivalents, say 12mm and 18mm,
for half and three quarters of an inch?

Is there any kind of heritage use of the "mile"? Which at least in the
USA is 5280 feet. I seem to recall it harkens back to "mille" meaning
1000.. something, strides, revolutions of a standard wagon wheel.
Hmm... a'googling I will go: aha, 1000 'paces' or 5,000 Roman feet,
with national variations. It's like metric is esperanto for metrology.
Nobod wants to adopt anyone else's measures, so something new and
different from everything else was invented. yay french revolution,
from the people who brought you Napoleon, let me introduce you to the
meter, like a yard, but different enought to be inconvenient.


--
Dan Stephenson
http://web.mac.com/stepheda
Travel pages for Europe and the U.S.A. (and New Zealand too)

On 2011-11-21 04:37:49 -0600, Tom P said:

On 11/19/2011 02:19 AM, Dan Stephenson wrote:
On 2011-11-14 14:16:48 -0600, Jean said:


in Britain they willingly create confusion (pounds, feets, oz, driving
at the left),


I think driving on the left is really great. I'm right-handed, and I can
use right-hand to steer but shift with my left. And as I love
scenic-driving in Britain and Ireland, it is incredibly helpful to point
my camera out the window with the right hand (my camera of the style
that is meant to be held and 80% operated with the right hand). I just
wish Norway hadn't gone over to driving on the right for my drive up the
fjordlands to the Nordkapp a couple years back.

Norway? Wasn't that Sweden over forty years ago?

Sorry, that's right, I mis-remembered.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dagen_H

That is crazy. Love the photo. Interesting, too, however it was
defeated in a referendum in 1955 but in 1963 the parliament gave a big
Screw You to the public and made it happen anyway.



some interesting history he
http://users.telenet.be/worldstandar...the%20left.htm

Now that is really interesting, thanks!



--
Dan Stephenson
http://web.mac.com/stepheda
Travel pages for Europe and the U.S.A. (and New Zealand too)

On 2011-11-21 06:01:58 -0600, Martin said:

On Mon, 21 Nov 2011 11:37:49 +0100, Tom P wrote:

On 11/19/2011 02:19 AM, Dan Stephenson wrote:
On 2011-11-14 14:16:48 -0600, Jean said:


in Britain they willingly create confusion (pounds, feets, oz, driving
at the left),


I think driving on the left is really great. I'm right-handed, and I can
use right-hand to steer but shift with my left.

Unless you have a health problem steering with the left hand and
changing gear with the right hand is easier for right handed drivers.
Gear changing requires more manual dexterity than holding a wheel.

How do you know this, and that it is a health issue?

Anyway - for me, I like the right-sided orientation. I was SO SCARED
when I first tried it. All the rental place has was Nissan Almera - a
rather large car - and I had to drive in the narrow British roads with
a constant "I'm gonna get hit!!" feeling about once ever five minutes.
In the two weeks I drove, I finally got somewhat competent at the end.
Since then, on subsequent trips there was only an initial
accustomization, and then, it was usually to remember to not open the
door on the left side of the car, because, surprise! there is no
steering wheel there! ha



And as I love
scenic-driving in Britain and Ireland, it is incredibly helpful to point
my camera out the window with the right hand (my camera of the style
that is meant to be held and 80% operated with the right hand).

Europeans/normal people would get out of the car to take a photo. What
happens when the view is on the left of the car? Do a U turn and then
take the photo?

Don't be an ass.

I get out of the car whenever I can, however, and especially for the
roads with no pull-over and are narrow, such as is often the case e.g.
in Britain, the only practical solutions is an in-car photo.

And you hold the camera up and turn it left to point over the roof.

It's also cool when filming driving the crazy places.


I just
wish Norway hadn't gone over to driving on the right for my drive up the
fjordlands to the Nordkapp a couple years back.

Norway? Wasn't that Sweden over forty years ago?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dagen_H

some interesting history he
http://users.telenet.be/worldstandar...the%20left.htm


--
Dan Stephenson
http://web.mac.com/stepheda
Travel pages for Europe and the U.S.A. (and New Zealand too)