American dollars is plunging: NO MORE TRAVEL!

"alohacyberian" schreef in bericht
...
"Vitaly Shmatikov" wrote in message
...
In article
,
alohacyberian wrote:

Sjoerd, you are an America-basher from way back as are most Communists.

This is obviously true, but you've got to feel sorry for Sjoerd. He
has
been brainwashed by European mass media and reduced to regurgitating
the same old lies about America that he gets from newspapers and TV.
On the other hand, having been to America, he is aware of the
truth at some level, which is why he is so desperately envious of
American freedom and quality of life. The result is his peculiar
love-hate relationship with America, half jealousy, half resentment.
Quite amusing to watch, really.

Very well stated and oh, so true.

Two Americans here that get their news from Fox. I can't really blame them,
they are too stupid to see the truth.

Sjoerd

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 01:20:40 +0000, pmlt
wrote:

On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 19:56:30 -0500, wrote:

It's a very long period then, because Germany has been in the doldrums
for several years (though not as long as Japan). European growth
overall has been much lower than in the US over more than the last
decade. Ours last 1 to 2 years at the most. Hardly comparable.


So basically you've re-written your argument. Fair enough. You are in
fact right in the idea that the US has been growing a lot more than
Europe, since the early 90's. That has been the reason for a lot of
discussion in all the European countries about what should be our
growth and society model. Fact is, the USA is beating Europe both in
economic power/growth and in social problems. Europe wants the first
one without endangering the latter.


Longer working hours means worse quality of life. That's something
taken very seriously over here.

Sure, for lazy types that like to live off of others all while their
pensions are disappearing.


Your lack of productivity and a low work ethic are, among other
reasons, why European countries can't begin to pay for their pensions,
which are being cut all over the place. You call that a better
quality of life? Then tell me why all those French and Italians are
demonstrating against the cuts then? You think there is a free lunch?


There is no such thing as a free lunch. That is EXACTLY why longer
working hours mean worse quality of life.

What you miss here once again is that "Europe" is a group of many
different countries. There are several with a bigger hourly
productivity than the US and others that don't reach it.

http://europa.eu.int/comm/eurostat/P...&mode=download

Baloney. Why don't you try looking at real statistics that show the
exact opposite? Try these:
ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/special.reques...bor/flsgdp.txt



Learn a bit more before saying that working less hours is the reason
why European countries in general will have in the future difficulties
to pay for the pensions (which are in fact not bad at all!). Learn
about the quality of the pensions in most of the European countries
(not all), the aging population, and then you'll start to know the
reasons behind it.

I do know the reasons behind it and have been pointing them out to
Swedes and Danes for years. What these countries have all done is rip
off as much tax as they could from everyone, promise them the moon
even as it became clearer and clearer that these couldn't be paid for
and delivered, then cut them while continuing to rip off as much tax
money as possible. And, of course, an aging population (know for
years--great planning) and stagnant economies ARE the prime causes.
We have similar problems here and offset the first with continued
immigration to build the working population and put in place growth
policies that PAY for our pensions, along with allowing people to
build their own. Unlike Europe, to my knowledge, we have never cut
Social Seucrity here and the benefits go up with inflation. All this
occurred in Europe when the Euro was weak. Just wait and see what
happens to your fictiious paradise while it is strong.




Give us all the ones that have averaged less than the US rate over the
last decade.

That wasn't the question. Are you changing the questions to meet your
objectives?

Meaning there are exacttly none.



then go read about what is going on right now in France.

I don't have to read to know about it, my almost-wife is French and I
have access to the French news and reality other than by just reading.

Goes along with the almost democratic France--as long as you
unfailingly conform.



This edict
is very clear: get rid of your scarf or stay out of school. Period.

Long decade-long discussion that is not close to an end.


This is a classic case of the French treating unequal cases equally
then trying to pontificate about equality.

Wow, a "Classic"? I wonder what a Classic is!

Now you know.


This case has
been all over the news and was started about two young girls trying to
wear their scarves.

Actually there are more than 2 girls envolved.
Anyway I'm not going to argue regarding this subject as I don't agree
with prohibiting such kind of things in public schools. But I will
never say that this is because the French are not democratic
whatsoever.

Typical European rationalization of the obvious to anyone else.
Nothing like a democracy where the government outright dictates what
you're religious beliefs can be I say. Called a dictatorship in China
and quite a few other countries with the same practice.


As for instance I don't agree with prohibiting people to smoke in
public spaces even though I hate the smoke.


You wouldn't. Of course, people have a right to poison other people
if they feel like it.

The
nice folks of Europe would treat me for who I was...until they learn that I
was an American.

So you're saying that the Euros are America-hating bigots ... and it's all
Bush's fault?

"Sjoerd" wrote in message
...

"alohacyberian" schreef in bericht
...
"Vitaly Shmatikov" wrote in message
...
In article
,
alohacyberian wrote:

Sjoerd, you are an America-basher from way back as are most
Communists.

This is obviously true, but you've got to feel sorry for Sjoerd. He
has
been brainwashed by European mass media and reduced to regurgitating
the same old lies about America that he gets from newspapers and TV.
On the other hand, having been to America, he is aware of the
truth at some level, which is why he is so desperately envious of
American freedom and quality of life. The result is his peculiar
love-hate relationship with America, half jealousy, half resentment.
Quite amusing to watch, really.

Very well stated and oh, so true.

Two Americans here that get their news from Fox. I can't really blame
them,
they are too stupid to see the truth.


Agreed that Fox News is biased to the point that it's not really a news
organization. It's more like a 24 hour editorial channel. But at the same
time I wonder why so few Europeans think that their media is biased. I have
a suspicion that it's for the same reason that so many American Republicans
have a hard time seeing the bias in Fox News, namely that people tend to
think that the news is being presentented neutrally when they happen to
agree with the presenter's point of view.

"Sjoerd" wrote in message
...

"Vitaly Shmatikov" schreef in bericht
...
In article
,
alohacyberian wrote:

Sjoerd, you are an America-basher from way back as are most Communists.

This is obviously true, but you've got to feel sorry for Sjoerd. He
has
been brainwashed by European mass media and reduced to regurgitating
the same old lies about America that he gets from newspapers and TV.
On the other hand, having been to America, he is aware of the
truth at some level, which is why he is so desperately envious of
American freedom and quality of life. The result is his peculiar
love-hate relationship with America, half jealousy, half resentment.
Quite amusing to watch, really.

So funny. First, the old brainwashed argument again. Ha! I read newspapers
and magazines from many countries (including the US) regularly, I watch TV
from many countries (including the USA) regularly, but no, Mr. Vitaly
insists that if I don't watch AND believe FOX news that I am brainwashed.
So
funny.
Secondly, the old jealousy argument again. How arrogant can you be,
Vitaly?
I have repeatedly stated that I have more freedoms here than I could ever
have in the USA. Heck, I wouldn't even be allowed to live with my partner
of
more than 9 years in the US.
Open your eyes, Vitaly, and see that there is a huge world outside the
USA.
The US is *not* "the best country in the world", as you have been
indoctrinated to believe.


Why would you not be allowed to live with your partner of 9 years if you
lived in the USA? Homosexuals are allowed to live togehter in the USA even
though gay marriages are not yet recognized.

"lh" schreef in bericht
...

Why would you not be allowed to live with your partner of 9 years if you
lived in the USA?

Because I have been offered a job in the US where the employer would arrange
the work and residence permits for me. Had I been married to a woman, she
would have received a residence permit almost automatically. But no chance
to get such a permit for a same-sex partner.

Sjoerd

"lh" schreef in bericht
...

Agreed that Fox News is biased to the point that it's not really a news
organization. It's more like a 24 hour editorial channel. But at the
same
time I wonder why so few Europeans think that their media is biased.

Because we have a very diverse media landscape here, with very conservative
newspapers that for instance support the US occupation of Iraq, and very
liberal ones that oppose it. So by reading 2 or 3 newspapers you get both
opinions and "supporting evidence".
The US media are almost all very conservative and right-wing. For instance,
I don't think there is a major network nor a major newspaper in the USA that
opposes the war in Iraq.

Sjoerd

In article ,
"Sjoerd" wrote:

"lh" schreef in bericht
...

Why would you not be allowed to live with your partner of 9 years if you
lived in the USA?

Because I have been offered a job in the US where the employer would arrange
the work and residence permits for me. Had I been married to a woman,

How long have you been 'married' to your partner ?


While in many cases spouses to get to come on work visa, but it is far
from always the case.

she
would have received a residence permit almost automatically. But no chance
to get such a permit for a same-sex partner.


You tried ?

jay
Sat, Dec 27, 2003



Sjoerd



--

Legend insists that as he finished his abject...
Galileo muttered under his breath: "Nevertheless, it does move."

"Sjoerd" wrote in message
...

"lh" schreef in bericht
...

Why would you not be allowed to live with your partner of 9 years if you
lived in the USA?

Because I have been offered a job in the US where the employer would
arrange
the work and residence permits for me. Had I been married to a woman, she
would have received a residence permit almost automatically. But no chance
to get such a permit for a same-sex partner.

I can understand that immigration would be a problem, but if both of you
were either US citizens or had valid visas you definetely would be allowed
to live with each other in the USA. I wonder if you would have the same
immigation problem if you were trying to get a residence permit for a woman
to whom you were not married. But without a doubt Holland is more liberal
than the US in terms of gay rights.

Knotso wrote:
The nice folks of Europe would treat me for who I was...until they learn
that I was an American.

So you're saying that the Euros are America-hating bigots ... and it's all
Bush's fault?

I think he's actually saying he hasn't been to Europe. My recent experience
hasn't been anything like that.

miguel
--
Hundreds of travel photos from around the world: http://travel.u.nu/