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#61
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The Reids wrote: Following up to Rita My heartfelt condolences... the elation of the "Games" to this very low point. As a New Yorker, my condolences as well. I love London and hearing about the destruction, deaths, injuries and the fear that Londoners will experience as a result for a long time to come makes me ill. I know people there will respond with courage, just as New Yorkers did to 9/11. thanks both. I remember posting same on 9/11 or 11/9 as we would call it, its a pity that the solidarity the west felt at that moment has dissipated to some extent. Yeah, thanks to our incompetent president, whose moronic reaction to this latest outrage was to say the perpetrators have "evil in their hearts"! (IMO, ALL fanaticism is "evil", be it Moslem, Christian or whatever.) |
#62
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#63
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From: Rita Organization: Road Runner - NYC Newsgroups: rec.travel.europe Date: Thu, 07 Jul 2005 16:04:22 GMT Subject: Bombs in LOndon Do you think France will be exempt from this kind of attack since it did not participate in the Iraq war? Seems Denmark and Italy have been warned. No. For the Islamists there are plenty of issues to go around. The banning of the Islamic veil in the schools here still rankles with the Islamist fanatics. And the French are in Afghanistan, an Islamic country, fighting alongside the rest of the Europeans who are there. Donna Evleth |
#64
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#65
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Rita wrote:
On Thu, 07 Jul 2005 17:44:47 +0200, Earl Evleth wrote: On 7/07/05 16:32, in article , "Rita" wrote: On 7 Jul 2005 06:45:07 -0700, wrote: we could stop invading other peoples countries in search of oil, that might lessen our exposure. I agree the invasion of Iraq has made both the U.S. and Britain ongoing targets. However, our leaders in both countries are adamant against changing their course. Recent polls showed that the majority of Americans have become disenchanted with the war in Iraq and don't believe it has made us "safer". And England re-elected Blair as well. If I understand what Bin Laden has said and why Al Qaeda took the form it did, these radical Muslims are against non-Muslim presence in Islamic nations. That is the basic core of what is driving them. A secondary issue is protecting Muslims in nations which are not mainly Muslim. These radicals telegraphed their intentions and did so long before 9/11. It seems likely that if the US had withdrawn rapidly from Saudi Arabia after the Gulf War One, we might have avoided the Embassy bombings and eventually 9/11. But US national interests (oil, never forget it) seemed involved and we could not bring ourself to stand off, possibly not thinking that Bin Laden was a real treat, just a bother. It should also be noted that Islamic radicals were also at war with an secular socialist movements in mainly Arab states. The Ba'ath party movements in Syria and Iraq were national socialist secular reactions against radical Islam, especially the Muslim Brotherhood movement which was given birth in Egypt. This is also why there was virtually no coordination of terrorist movements between Iraq and Al Qaeda. However the Ba'ath party movement is also totally decadent, Saddam was one example of that, and probably could not serve forever as Western supported buffer against both Iran and radical Islam in the middle east. US policy itself was decadent in the region and that is why radical Islam has grown more powerful. For some reason the Bush administration never figured that out or projected not having done so for pandering reasons of wanting to tie 9/11 with Iraq. The American people still appeared mostly duped about this. What did happen is that radical Islamic terrorists moved into Iraq opportunistically no longer having to fight Saddam. The new base of terrorism has, therefore, shifted from Afghanistan to Iraq. But that situation has become more complicated with the development of a sectarian conflict between Sunnites and Shi'ites in that country. This has also brought into Iraq Wahhabite Saudi terrorists (the 9/11 terrorists were mainly from this group) who even more strongly believe that Shi'ites are heretics. I use the "dragon teeth" analogy. If you plant dragon's teeth, they produce more dragons. Bush in not concentrating on just Afghanistan sewed dragon's teeth, they gave birth and some of the dragons showed up in London today. They showed up in Madrid a year ago and may now appear in more of Europe. I don't think there are a lot of dragon's teeth in Europe are around but even a few hundred or a thousand will cause us trouble. If we in turn, turn to abusing the Moslem populations in the UK and Europe, the dragan's teeth will increase in numbers, a lot. I think the above is a reasonable analysis. There now seem to be various splinter groups from Al Queda, and who knows what will set them off? There is little doubt in my mind that the Iraq war has greatly increased successful recruitment of Islamic radicals. It is such a mixed picture there, with the Sunnis playing their game, and according to a story in the NY Times yesterday, certain Shiites, back by Iran, still bent on a religious Islamic state in Iraq, are trying to take control in Basra and the South. The only thing I know for certain is that Bush's boast that "we are fighting them in Iraq so we won't have to fight them at home" rings very hollow. As a New Yorker, I'd be a fool indeed to take Bush at his word on this. Do you think France will be exempt from this kind of attack since it did not participate in the Iraq war? Seems Denmark and Italy have been warned. It seems to me that one factor which is overlooked by those who label the bombers as "islamic fanatics" and "terrorists" is that the arabic culture traditionally demands blood revenge for killing. Consequently, just as 9/11 was blood revenge for the US-Israeli action against the palestinians, the Madrid and now the London bombings are blood revenge for the killing of thousands of innocent Iraqis in the current war. T. |
#66
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The Reids wrote: Following up to Des Small And England re-elected Blair as well. not because of the war policy, the opposition are also pro war and on other issues its a no contest. the Lib Dems and The Greens were NOT pro war. |
#67
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But it was never plausible that they would form a government this time
round. (Not that it was every very likely the Tories would either.) |
#68
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"EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" wrote in message ... The Reids wrote: Following up to Des Small As a New Yorker, my condolences as well. I love London and hearing about the destruction, deaths, injuries and the fear that Londoners will experience as a result for a long time to come makes me ill. With all due respect, ******** to that. I was planning to go up to London tomorrow, and if the trains are running I still will. quiet right, I'll not be scared off by some fanatic, (no not Ken) its called terrorism, so they win if you are terrorised. "London can take it" comment by six month London immigrant after an IRA bomb. Considering how England bore up for several years as the bastion against Hitler (before the U.S. got around to joining in) I don't think anyone doubts it! (Although it is perhaps easier when it's a declared war, and you KNOW you can expect such horrors.) Diva, Read your history and that will tell you why we didn't get involved at the beginning of the war in Europe. Don |
#70
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The Reids wrote: Following up to Nils Zonneveld Terrorism only started on 9/11 for Americans, the IRA existed long before this. Unfortunately their activity was paid for by American fund raising. I don't think this is an appropiate reaction at this time. he's a rather unpleasant self confessed troll. Clearly. Best wishes from the USA in this time of confusion and sadness. |
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